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age 19, travis wolfkill was convicted of stabbing and beating his grandmother to death over a $300 tax refund check. he's currently on appeal but his sentence is life without parole. >> you don't really wrap your mind around it. because i'm not doing time. i'm just living life. it's a life different from out there. we have a lot of the same things in here that you do have out there. it's a little world in here. >> wolfkill devotes much of his time to his religion, satanism. >> i'm in a satanic group here. only about four of us here. it's a small community. >> the thing about satanism, we don't encourage or condone the breaking of laws. one of the biggest misconceptions about satanists is that we worship the devil. we pay homage to lucifer. the truth is, we don't believe in satan, we don't believe in lucifer. he's merely a symbol. who is satan? the original rebel. this actually has all of the teachings in it. this has what's called the 11 satanic rules of the earth. if you look at number nine, it says do not harm little children. number ten says do not kill nonhuman animals unless you a
age 19, travis wolfkill was convicted of stabbing and beating his grandmother to death over a $300 tax refund check. he's currently on appeal but his sentence is life without parole. >> you don't really wrap your mind around it. because i'm not doing time. i'm just living life. it's a life different from out there. we have a lot of the same things in here that you do have out there. it's a little world in here. >> wolfkill devotes much of his time to his religion, satanism. >>...
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will it be about the changes in position on the 47% and on taxes and on other things? also, the brainwashing has occurred over a period of time. he didn't just fundamentally come out yesterday and chuck everything. he was evolving towards these new positions, which may continue to evolve. for obama to go after him on this, it's like nailing jell-o to the wall. it's not an easy task for obama, because not exactly sure where he's criticizincriticizing. i don't think it opens up a clear line of aattack and i don't think americans pay a lot of attention to foreign policy. >> dana millbank, thanks. see you soon. what this means for the other names on the ballot. it's in the spin as "the cycle" runs on for today, tuesday, october 9th. [ male announcer ] eligible for medicare? that's a good thing, but it doesn't cover everything. only about 80% of your part b medical expenses. the rest is up to you. so consider an aarp medicare supplement insurance plan, insured by unitedhealthcare insurance company. like all standardized medicare supplement plans, they help save you up to th
will it be about the changes in position on the 47% and on taxes and on other things? also, the brainwashing has occurred over a period of time. he didn't just fundamentally come out yesterday and chuck everything. he was evolving towards these new positions, which may continue to evolve. for obama to go after him on this, it's like nailing jell-o to the wall. it's not an easy task for obama, because not exactly sure where he's criticizincriticizing. i don't think it opens up a clear line of...
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and other taxes and at an effective rate higher than romney pays his taxes. over 10% of them are senior citizens on social security. the rest are disabled vets and veterans and military personnel fighting now. that's the 47%. the 47%, this nation depends on to build this country. folks, it's about time governor romney takes some responsibility. [ cheers and applause ] take some responsibility to help the american people, the middle class. instead of lining up to sign a pledge to a guy named grover in order kwis. >> ezra, i have to say for me one of my favorite moments in the debate was with him pointing out the effective rate romney pays compared to what other people in the real world pay. i'm not sure how many people jumped on that a as their favorite moment but. >> you and me, lawrence. >> but biden is finding more effective ways of isolating that romney tax return 14% number. >> it wasn't just that. biden i thought actually figured out what obama didn't figure out a week before which is how to deal with the ryan/romney ticket on taxes, medicare and social
and other taxes and at an effective rate higher than romney pays his taxes. over 10% of them are senior citizens on social security. the rest are disabled vets and veterans and military personnel fighting now. that's the 47%. the 47%, this nation depends on to build this country. folks, it's about time governor romney takes some responsibility. [ cheers and applause ] take some responsibility to help the american people, the middle class. instead of lining up to sign a pledge to a guy named...
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they pay more effective tax than governor romney pays in his federal income tax. i have had it up to here with this notion that 47% -- it's about time they take some responsibility here, and instead of signing pledges to grover norquist not to ask the wealthiest among us to contribute to bring back the middle class, they should be signing a pledge saying to the middle class, we're going to level the playing field. >> joe klein, that's a winning riff from my account. the way he pronounced grover norquist is the way i pronounce with a "d" in it, it's like complete disdain for anybody to sign a petition -- >> i think he won the debate at that moment. you know what distinguished that from almost everything else we see in these debates? it was real. that wasn't political talk. that wasn't focus group talk. that wasn't consultant talk. that was just joe. >> joe klein, great having you on. chris, up next. >>> tea party and berther. congressman showed up with some writing on his hands. he said he wasn't actually cheating. he hadn't washed his hands. from a previous case i
they pay more effective tax than governor romney pays in his federal income tax. i have had it up to here with this notion that 47% -- it's about time they take some responsibility here, and instead of signing pledges to grover norquist not to ask the wealthiest among us to contribute to bring back the middle class, they should be signing a pledge saying to the middle class, we're going to level the playing field. >> joe klein, that's a winning riff from my account. the way he pronounced...
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that of course creates more tax revenue. in essence, you have more revenue that could be used in the government. so what we're looking at is -- >> by the way, just -- the 12 million figure that you guys like to use, economists have said if no one does anything, 12 million jobs are going to be added over the next few years. to say that 12 million jobs is an incredible achievement. >> i would say it's incredible when you look at president obama's current stagnant economy, when you're only seeing the gdp growing at 1.2%. and less than 114,000 jobs are being created a month. i mean it's just been, the way president obama has worked, where he's not been able to work with congress, not been able to provide the leadership to really get this economy going. just shows he has a failed policy that hasn't worked. we're seeing that medium household incomes have dropped. not enough jobs, jobs are not being created at the rate they should be created. under his plan, it would cost 700,000 jobs. that's not the plan we need to have for americ
that of course creates more tax revenue. in essence, you have more revenue that could be used in the government. so what we're looking at is -- >> by the way, just -- the 12 million figure that you guys like to use, economists have said if no one does anything, 12 million jobs are going to be added over the next few years. to say that 12 million jobs is an incredible achievement. >> i would say it's incredible when you look at president obama's current stagnant economy, when you're...
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federal income, state sales tax, property tax cab gas tax, over 50% of what they earned. and your plan is to take the tax rate on successful small businesses from 35% to 40%. the national federation of independent businesses has said that will cost 700,000 jobs. >> what is main street's reaction? we have two of our most outspeaken regulars here to discuss. app entrepreneur and best-selling author, find him at rural 1 investing upon the com. carol roth, can you find her at carolroth.com. good to you you guy he. >> you too, j. >> i think it is clear that romney ran all over obama. from a small business owner's perspective he addressed the issues we have not seen addressed offer the laugh four years. most notably, how are we going to get this economy growing again because from a small business owner's perspective, that is what is going to get them hiring and make them more successful. if the economy grows, more people are buying from them. there's more confidence, and it is just a self fulfilling prophecy. >> what we are dealing with here, four years -- apart from what presi
federal income, state sales tax, property tax cab gas tax, over 50% of what they earned. and your plan is to take the tax rate on successful small businesses from 35% to 40%. the national federation of independent businesses has said that will cost 700,000 jobs. >> what is main street's reaction? we have two of our most outspeaken regulars here to discuss. app entrepreneur and best-selling author, find him at rural 1 investing upon the com. carol roth, can you find her at carolroth.com....
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celine dionne and steven segal owe the most in unpaid taxes. segal owes nearly $350,000. >>> finally, music talent must run in the family. this is my favorite. according to ancestry.com justin bieber is a distant cousin of ry ry ryan gosling. this dates back to the earliest settlers. i would love to be a part of that. if there's an extra seat at the table. >> i'm lynn berry, this is "first look" on msnbc. be sure to stay tuned. way too early with willie geist starts right now. >>> only way you can find $5 trillion in loopholes is cut the mortgage deduction for middle class people, cut the health care deduction, take away their ability to take away their tax break to send their kids to college. >> is he wrong about that? >> he is wrong about that. >> how's that? >> you can cut the taxes and preserve the cuts for them. >> not mathematically possible. >> it is. it's been don
celine dionne and steven segal owe the most in unpaid taxes. segal owes nearly $350,000. >>> finally, music talent must run in the family. this is my favorite. according to ancestry.com justin bieber is a distant cousin of ry ry ryan gosling. this dates back to the earliest settlers. i would love to be a part of that. if there's an extra seat at the table. >> i'm lynn berry, this is "first look" on msnbc. be sure to stay tuned. way too early with willie geist starts...
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who pays taxes ought to get tax relief. a of my plan is in place the wealthiest americans will pay a higher percentage of taxes than they do today and the poorest of americans, 6 million families, 7 million people won't pay any tax at all. >> notice the slight of hands. the wealthiest americans will pay a higher percentage of taxes than they do today. not a higher percentage of their income in taxes since that would be an outright lie. very common bit of conservative bit of misdirection used to hide the distributional tax cuts they're proposing. for instance, even in herman cain's explicitly progressive world of a 9/9/9 flat tax, you can imagine the wealthiest households would still pay a majority of total income tax revenue. that doesn't reflect how progressive or fair the taxation system is. it reflects just how unequal incomes are. bush did it again in the next debate too. >> my plan is that the wealthy people pay 62% of the taxes today after which they pay 64%. this is a fair plan. you know why? because the tax code is
who pays taxes ought to get tax relief. a of my plan is in place the wealthiest americans will pay a higher percentage of taxes than they do today and the poorest of americans, 6 million families, 7 million people won't pay any tax at all. >> notice the slight of hands. the wealthiest americans will pay a higher percentage of taxes than they do today. not a higher percentage of their income in taxes since that would be an outright lie. very common bit of conservative bit of misdirection...
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overall taxes that they pay and the overall tax plan would be tax neutral. i mean, it would be revenue neutral. the other piece is you mentioned this other story -- >> the story is specifics, hasn't it? >> i'll keep going back to this to seep the record straight. you all talking about this story that mitt romney had been saying and reported in other places that this is a new softer side of mitt romney. he's been telling that story for months. and so, i mean, this is all just sort of a generated media narrative that he is coming up with all sorts of new policies and new touching stories. this is, you know, what's great about last week is it's our opportunity to present an unfiltered mitt romney versus an unfiltered barack obama and the choice was houistorically. >> let's ask you then about specifically what the panelist talked about, the thing that a lot of analysts are watching is are the polls going to move in the swing states? it is early to tell. the jobs numbers may factor in to this. can mitt romney move the polls in a place like ohio? where before the
overall taxes that they pay and the overall tax plan would be tax neutral. i mean, it would be revenue neutral. the other piece is you mentioned this other story -- >> the story is specifics, hasn't it? >> i'll keep going back to this to seep the record straight. you all talking about this story that mitt romney had been saying and reported in other places that this is a new softer side of mitt romney. he's been telling that story for months. and so, i mean, this is all just sort of...
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jack kennedy lowered tax rates. >> now you're jack kennedy? >> ronald reagan -- >> biden trying to make a moment of his own capitalizing when ryan brought up jfk. >> this is a bunch of stuff. look, here's the deal. >> what does that mean, a bunch of stuff? >> it's irish. >> we irish call it malarkey. >> it all came down to, again, stuff in this light moment. >> joe and i are from similar towns. he's from scranton, pennsylvania, i'm in james, wisconsin. you know what the unemployment is in scranton? 10%. when you guys came in it's 8.5%. >> you don't read this. that's not how it's going. it's going down. >> look -- >> all right. you're going to hear more about the debate coming up throughout the day on msnbc. that is going to wrap up this hour of "jansing and company." i'm chris jansing. richard lui is in next. >> malarkey was my favorite. one of the top tweeted moments. >> unbelievable how much traction that got. >> have a good weekend. coming up this next hour, pardon the interruption, the vice president brings the heat with laughs, guffaws an
jack kennedy lowered tax rates. >> now you're jack kennedy? >> ronald reagan -- >> biden trying to make a moment of his own capitalizing when ryan brought up jfk. >> this is a bunch of stuff. look, here's the deal. >> what does that mean, a bunch of stuff? >> it's irish. >> we irish call it malarkey. >> it all came down to, again, stuff in this light moment. >> joe and i are from similar towns. he's from scranton, pennsylvania, i'm in james,...
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i don't pledge to raise or cut taxes on the wealthy in this country. i love teachers. you know, i think we should have more of them. a whopolicy positions that disappeared instantaneously on that stage. i have no doubt, though, that president obama and vice president biden understand now that we're dealing with a guy that looks a lot like mndz romney and sounds like mitt romney, but we have mitt romney who believes that we ought to cut taxes on the wealthy as a way to prop up and drive economic growth, and that's his single economic theory, and we've got a guy who believes that we should be cutting teachers, not hiring more of them to invest in growth. >> robert, it's willie. it's good to see you this morning. >> hey, willie. >> i hope you can promise the american people and obama supporters that gene chizik won't be involved in the debate prep for the next debate. >> did joe put you up to that? >> that was all me, robert. >> please call joe scarborough and tell him to quit going negative. >> robert, i'm right here. >> we have a big game against vandy coming up, willie
i don't pledge to raise or cut taxes on the wealthy in this country. i love teachers. you know, i think we should have more of them. a whopolicy positions that disappeared instantaneously on that stage. i have no doubt, though, that president obama and vice president biden understand now that we're dealing with a guy that looks a lot like mndz romney and sounds like mitt romney, but we have mitt romney who believes that we ought to cut taxes on the wealthy as a way to prop up and drive economic...
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tax cuts. a guy who says we shouldn't be having mission creep in libya but wants mission creep in syria. he's been on all sides of the issues. >> that's just in the last week. >> the president needs to just say these things, it's not obvious to people watching on tv. when you're in a debate it's helpful to talk about it at that time rather than in the rallies afterwards. the jobs question is very interesting. he's trying to convince people in ohio where the unemployment rate is lower than the national average, which already is coming down -- >> in a place where the president's plan to save the auto industry actually protected many jobs. >> so in the face of all the evidence around them, and you can argue about economic statistics as much as you like, but people know their own economy and their own lives. he's trying to put against that by saying there are joshs in the ground we will dig up presumagely by pulling away from environmental regulations. he's talking really about fracking. that's his
tax cuts. a guy who says we shouldn't be having mission creep in libya but wants mission creep in syria. he's been on all sides of the issues. >> that's just in the last week. >> the president needs to just say these things, it's not obvious to people watching on tv. when you're in a debate it's helpful to talk about it at that time rather than in the rallies afterwards. the jobs question is very interesting. he's trying to convince people in ohio where the unemployment rate is...
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. >> you can do that by cutting taxes? >> those are your words, not mine. >> thank you very much, sir. >> that was kind of strange. trying to stuff words in people's mouths? >> it sounds like you're -- >> ryan folks putting the paper in front of the camera and everything. vice presidential nominee paul ryan getting annoyed in this interview with terry camp in flint, michigan. the campaign even after the interview was over still went out of their way to trash the reporter that paul ryan walked out of that interview on. the campaign giving on the record quotes calling the reporter an embarrassment. the city where that reporter works and where that interview took place does have the worst violent crime rate in the nation. god bless flint, michigan. so that line of questioning here for mr. ryan was understandable. maybe even predictable. but beyond the newsworthiness of paul ryan getting up and taking off his microphone and ending the interview and beyond the newsworthiness of the campaign going after this reporter, there was
. >> you can do that by cutting taxes? >> those are your words, not mine. >> thank you very much, sir. >> that was kind of strange. trying to stuff words in people's mouths? >> it sounds like you're -- >> ryan folks putting the paper in front of the camera and everything. vice presidential nominee paul ryan getting annoyed in this interview with terry camp in flint, michigan. the campaign even after the interview was over still went out of their way to trash...
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president, you are right with regards to 97% of the businesses are not taxed at 35% tax rate, it's a lower rate. those businesses, the last 3% happen to employ half, half of all the people who work in small business. >> okay. please respond to that. there is so much nonsense in that little bit of sound. >> first of all, the statistic that it employs half is ridiculous. let's look at it carefully. under that definition of small business, i'm a business. why? because i have written a book. i get royalties. that's business income. mitt romney cuts my taxes. now, i'm not going to hire anyone. this idea that cutting the taxes is going to lead to job growth is absurd. in contrast, the president saying i'm for tax cuts but i am if you actually hire someone. >> my brain was soup as i was trying to sort through all these definitions. the sba, small business administration is trying to define it as a business with 500 people or less. it's not the definition being used here. the definition here is a tax status. in this study. >> this is where the fact is wrong. >> yes. thank you. >> all people
president, you are right with regards to 97% of the businesses are not taxed at 35% tax rate, it's a lower rate. those businesses, the last 3% happen to employ half, half of all the people who work in small business. >> okay. please respond to that. there is so much nonsense in that little bit of sound. >> first of all, the statistic that it employs half is ridiculous. let's look at it carefully. under that definition of small business, i'm a business. why? because i have written a...
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they may more effective tax than governor romney pays in his federal incomes tax. i have had it up to here with this notion that 47% -- it's about time they take some responsibility here, and instead of signing pledges to grover norquist not to ask the wealthiest among us to contribute to bring back the middle class, they should be signing a pledge saying to the middle class, we're going to level the playing field. >> joe klein, that's a winning riff from my account. the way he pronounced grover norquist is the way i pronounce with a "d" in it, it's like complete disdain for -- >> i think he won the debate at that moment. you know what distinguished that from almost everything else we see in these debates? it was real. that wasn't political talk. that wasn't focus group talk. that wasn't consultant talk. that was just joe. >> okay. there are a number of moments in the debate when paul ryan seemed to be playing defense against biden's attacks. here were the two candidates squaring off on the romney tax plan which remains impossible to defend in terms of mathematics.
they may more effective tax than governor romney pays in his federal incomes tax. i have had it up to here with this notion that 47% -- it's about time they take some responsibility here, and instead of signing pledges to grover norquist not to ask the wealthiest among us to contribute to bring back the middle class, they should be signing a pledge saying to the middle class, we're going to level the playing field. >> joe klein, that's a winning riff from my account. the way he pronounced...
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what $5 trillion tax cut? i don't know anything about a $5 trillion tax cut. pay no attention to that tax cut under the carpet. >> romney's campaign continuing a blitz of ohio today denying that he's a new moderate but here is what he told the des moines register yesterday. when asked about his agenda on abortion. >> there's no legislation regarding -- with regards to abortion i'm familiar with that would become part of my agenda. >> joining me now, "usa today's" washington bureau chief susan page and "time" assistant managing editor. good morning, both of. >> did you good morning. >> susan, romney's statement appeared to be away from the democrats tried use against them and campaign quickly issued a statement saying mitt romney is pro-life. what is going on with the romney message? >> well, i think romney is -- governor romney is definitely trying to pivot to the middle. we were waiting to do this last spring and early summer when he clinched the republican nomination. he's doing it now kind of on the late side. it is the same sort of more centrist message th
what $5 trillion tax cut? i don't know anything about a $5 trillion tax cut. pay no attention to that tax cut under the carpet. >> romney's campaign continuing a blitz of ohio today denying that he's a new moderate but here is what he told the des moines register yesterday. when asked about his agenda on abortion. >> there's no legislation regarding -- with regards to abortion i'm familiar with that would become part of my agenda. >> joining me now, "usa today's"...
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they have some obligations to society, and yet they are saying, i don't want to be taxed and if i'm taxed, then i'm going to take it out on all of you, that have less job security than you've ever had, whose wages continue to drop, and whose homes not worth 30% less than they were worth before. >> do you think these pressure tactics are going to work on workers? i mean, there is, you know, a fear in the job place in america when bosses act like this. you know, they don't want to lose their job. they saw harry down the street lost his job and their family is having a hard time. that kind of thinking sets in, what the heck, it's just a vote, i'm going to go ahead and do it. what do you think about that? >> it's possible, ed. this is a very, very, very tight election. and even if you have 5% of the workers who are intimidated like this or 3% or 2%, it could make a difference. and with unemployment still high, it's getting better, but unemployment's still high, a lot of people are looking for work, there's not enough job security out there to guard against this kind of intimidation. >> what d
they have some obligations to society, and yet they are saying, i don't want to be taxed and if i'm taxed, then i'm going to take it out on all of you, that have less job security than you've ever had, whose wages continue to drop, and whose homes not worth 30% less than they were worth before. >> do you think these pressure tactics are going to work on workers? i mean, there is, you know, a fear in the job place in america when bosses act like this. you know, they don't want to lose...
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focus on the demand side and more focused on tax fairness. a real decision for obama to make if he's re-elected. >> right. one of the big mistakes that the obama administration says, they didn't have enough of the private sector organization. the one way i would propose to deal with that is put in someone like larry fink. people will scream, oh, my god, wall street. someone who's actually been in the trenches hiring and firing. you need somebody who's done that. >> speaking of the trenches, when you redo this game can you make it a foreign policy so we can do risk and attack on the country. >> thank you very much. up next, if you've ever wanted to see steve kornacki in high school, just wait. [ chuckles ] ♪ [ honk! ] ♪ [ honk! ] ♪ [ honk! ] ♪ [ male announcer ] now you'll know when to stop. [ honk! ] the all-new nissan altima with easy fill tire alert. [ honk! ] it's our most innovative altima ever. nissan. innovation that excites. ♪ innovation that excites. and every day since, two years ago, the people of bp made a commitment to t
focus on the demand side and more focused on tax fairness. a real decision for obama to make if he's re-elected. >> right. one of the big mistakes that the obama administration says, they didn't have enough of the private sector organization. the one way i would propose to deal with that is put in someone like larry fink. people will scream, oh, my god, wall street. someone who's actually been in the trenches hiring and firing. you need somebody who's done that. >> speaking of the...
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romney's tax returns. do you feel like the list of things that the democrats would like to be talking about here is a different list when it's paul ryan on the stage than when it is mitt romney on the stage? >> i would go to those ideological things. not so much the problematic problems governor romney faces personally but the ideological charts, do we really want to make a woman a murderer if she chooses to end a pregnancy, do we really want to get into that territory morally as a government? do we want to do that in civil society? do we want to be taking a wway e medicare promise to people in any generation when you say to a person when they reach their 80s, go out, get on a bus and go find yourself an insurance company that's going to insure your health at this point. do we really want to do those kinds of things? and was it right to deal ideologically with the auto industry when we had to interrupt the normal processes of the market and do something extraordinary? romney said, no, let it happen. let th
romney's tax returns. do you feel like the list of things that the democrats would like to be talking about here is a different list when it's paul ryan on the stage than when it is mitt romney on the stage? >> i would go to those ideological things. not so much the problematic problems governor romney faces personally but the ideological charts, do we really want to make a woman a murderer if she chooses to end a pregnancy, do we really want to get into that territory morally as a...
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going back to this issue of his taxes not only has he not released his tax returns, as many presidential candidates have in the past, of course, but he's effectively paid a 14% rate on his taxes, and that is something that is a lower rate paid on investment income. let's have a listen to a little bit of that ad. >> you've paid 14% in federal taxes. that's the capital gains rate. is that fair to the guy who makes $50,000 and paid a higher rate than you did? so you think it is fair? >> yeah, i think it's -- it's the right way you encourage economic growth. >> lower tax rates for him than us. is that the way to grow america? >> and so it goes, alex. the president leaving the white house just a little later this morning. >> mike viqueira, thank you very much. while the gop ticket is crisscrossing the crucial battleground state of ohio again today and mitt romney will be holding two events. one in portsmouth, another in lebanon. in hours paul ryan holds his rally in youngstown. that is where we find nbc's ron mott live at youngstown state university. we know that the campaign is making a very
going back to this issue of his taxes not only has he not released his tax returns, as many presidential candidates have in the past, of course, but he's effectively paid a 14% rate on his taxes, and that is something that is a lower rate paid on investment income. let's have a listen to a little bit of that ad. >> you've paid 14% in federal taxes. that's the capital gains rate. is that fair to the guy who makes $50,000 and paid a higher rate than you did? so you think it is fair?...
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they pay more effective tax than governor romney pays in his federal income tax. they are elderly people who are, in fact, living off social security. they're veterans and people fighting in afghanistan right now who are, quote, not paying any taxes. i've had it up to here with with this notion that 47% of -- it's about time they take some responsibility here. instead of signing pledges to grover norquist not to ask the wealthiest among us not to contribute to bring back the middle class, they should be signing a pledge saying to the middle class, we're going to level the playing field. >> that issue of taxes and which side wants to raise them and which side wants to cut them and on whom, that sparked one of the more spirited moments in tonight's debate. >> there aren't enough rich people in small businesses to tax to pay for all their spending. the next time you hear them say, don't worry about it, we'll get a few people to pay their share, watch out. they're coming for you. you can preserve these important preferences. >> it has never been done before. >> it's b
they pay more effective tax than governor romney pays in his federal income tax. they are elderly people who are, in fact, living off social security. they're veterans and people fighting in afghanistan right now who are, quote, not paying any taxes. i've had it up to here with with this notion that 47% of -- it's about time they take some responsibility here. instead of signing pledges to grover norquist not to ask the wealthiest among us not to contribute to bring back the middle class, they...
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sure, he said president obama didn't raise taxes, and president obama didn't raise taxes, but really, mitt romney officially thinks that he did. they have done this over and over and over and over again, on big issues like health reform, on small issues like whether he met a guy or not. and it is a ridiculous technique. i mean, think about what this means for the long run. i mean, the romney campaign is training the country to not believe this guy when he is talking. they're training the country to feel that, you know, wherever you hear mitt romney saying something today, don't worry, it doesn't really matter. it is all subject to revision later. long-term, this is a weird technique. it has been a strange political technique from the get-go this year. but mostly, it has worked for them. them correcting the record later on to a smaller audience has mostly worked. so they just keep doing it. and they have kept getting away with it. but now, as of today, they have seemed to have gone too far to get away with it anymore. this is what mitt romney told "the des moines register" editorial bo
sure, he said president obama didn't raise taxes, and president obama didn't raise taxes, but really, mitt romney officially thinks that he did. they have done this over and over and over and over again, on big issues like health reform, on small issues like whether he met a guy or not. and it is a ridiculous technique. i mean, think about what this means for the long run. i mean, the romney campaign is training the country to not believe this guy when he is talking. they're training the...
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eliminate income tax, corporate tax, abolish the irs and replace that with one federal consumption tax which i think really will create tens of millions of jobs given a zero corporate tax rate environment. >> well, you made that fairly easy. you ticked down that. but you can go into the details on this. as you know, a lot of those things could get accomplished given the two party duopoly in congress. but many of the issues that you're advocating are positions one or the other holds. so marriage equality, the obama/biden ticket is tfully supportive of that. balancing the budget now you say there is a big chunk of the republican party that advocates that. a lot of your views are being represented, though all just not in the same party. is that a fair statement? >> i think so but maybe not a fair statement from the standpoint that i think both parties give lip service to, for example, democrats give lip service to no military intervention when the reality is, continued military intervention. republicans give lip service to a balanced budget but, gentlemen gee, let's do it in 28 years and
eliminate income tax, corporate tax, abolish the irs and replace that with one federal consumption tax which i think really will create tens of millions of jobs given a zero corporate tax rate environment. >> well, you made that fairly easy. you ticked down that. but you can go into the details on this. as you know, a lot of those things could get accomplished given the two party duopoly in congress. but many of the issues that you're advocating are positions one or the other holds. so...
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. >> first of all, i don't have a $5 trillion tax cut. i'm not looking for a $5 trillion tax cut. let me repeat what i said, i'm not in favor after $5 trillion tax cut. that's not my plan. >> a romney's plan could cost the country $5 trillion over the next five years. his friends at fox news says he doesn't have to explain his fuzzy math. here is chris wallace depending romney's flip-flop to o'malley. >> the president says that mitt romney is proposing a $5 trillion tax cut. that's not true. >> kras, wait a minute here. the governor -- i mean, former governor romney, is proposing 0% cut to income taxes, including for the wealthiest of americans and 30% cut to corporate income taxes. any economist my debate whether that is 4.9 trillion or 5 trillion. >> you're mischaracterizing the romney plan. you're right, 5 trillion by lowering the tax rates but also cuts about cutting loop holes and -- >> ahhhh. >> but that is part of the plan. >> but he won't say which loop holes and which deductions. >> joining me washington post kol columnest and author. you. >> you have a lot of heart, ed.
. >> first of all, i don't have a $5 trillion tax cut. i'm not looking for a $5 trillion tax cut. let me repeat what i said, i'm not in favor after $5 trillion tax cut. that's not my plan. >> a romney's plan could cost the country $5 trillion over the next five years. his friends at fox news says he doesn't have to explain his fuzzy math. here is chris wallace depending romney's flip-flop to o'malley. >> the president says that mitt romney is proposing a $5 trillion tax cut....
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. >> how do you track your taxes. >> i pay my sales tax but for my 2011 taxes, i just guessed. >> you guessed? >> guestimated an amount. >> i think i guessed high. >> that's a technical foul, we call it. >> let's go look at the books. >> show us where they are. literally. i want to see it. >> this is the office? >> yes. >> this is where it all happens. i'm glad to see you have accounting records. >> those aren't mine. that's the previous business owner. >> okay. >> these are mine right here. >> all right. it looks like you followed their system. >> they headed back upstairs where dawn got erica started on a quickbooks account. >> hit finish. >> all right. >> now we've created the bank account. >> be brutally honest with me. erica is upstairs. >> sure. >> what's your first impression? >> hot mess. first interpretation of what i've seen here. not, again, not abnormal but frightening. >> can a business operate like this? >> well, they can for not very long. they won't be in business very long like this. >> okay. you feel confident we can fix it, get her on track. >> we can always fix it.
. >> how do you track your taxes. >> i pay my sales tax but for my 2011 taxes, i just guessed. >> you guessed? >> guestimated an amount. >> i think i guessed high. >> that's a technical foul, we call it. >> let's go look at the books. >> show us where they are. literally. i want to see it. >> this is the office? >> yes. >> this is where it all happens. i'm glad to see you have accounting records. >> those aren't mine....
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they pay more effective tax than governor romney pays in his federal income tax. i've had it up to here with this notion that 47% -- it's about time they take some responsibility here. and instead of signing pledges to grover norquist not to ask the wealthiest among us to contribute to bring back the middle class, they should be signing a pledge saying to the middle class, we're going to level the playing field. >> mitt romney is a good man. he cares about 100% of americans in this country. and with respect to that quote, i think the vice president very well knows that sometimes the words don't come out of your mouth the right way. >> but i always say what i mean. >> some great moments last night. welcome back to "morning joe." a live look at the white house as the sun comes up over washington. mark mckinnon's still with us. and joining us on set, nbc news's tom brokaw and moderator of "meet the press," david gregory. gentlemen, good to have you on board this hour. >> good morning. >> wow! where do we begin? what a great night. >> how about david grinning like a c
they pay more effective tax than governor romney pays in his federal income tax. i've had it up to here with this notion that 47% -- it's about time they take some responsibility here. and instead of signing pledges to grover norquist not to ask the wealthiest among us to contribute to bring back the middle class, they should be signing a pledge saying to the middle class, we're going to level the playing field. >> mitt romney is a good man. he cares about 100% of americans in this...
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do we deliver tax cuts? it's important that the president do this for the basic reason that people in this country know what they are voting for and if they decide against. and that's "hardball" for now. "politicsnation" with al sharpton starts right now. >> thanks, chris, and thanks to you for tuning in. tonight's lead, no hiding from biden. for months mitt romney and paul ryan have been running from their records, hiding their extreme far right agenda behind platitudes and big promises, trying to pin them down on specifics was like trying to nail jello to the wall. but that all stopped last night. we'll talk about all of it in the show tonight, how vice president biden took the fight to paul ryan on issue after issue. on taxes, on medicare, on abortion, on their plan to privatize social security and to gut medicare. joe biden simply dismantled the romney/ryan world view. but also talk about how the right wingers are trying to make a big deal out of joe biden's smile. so what? i would have been outright lau
do we deliver tax cuts? it's important that the president do this for the basic reason that people in this country know what they are voting for and if they decide against. and that's "hardball" for now. "politicsnation" with al sharpton starts right now. >> thanks, chris, and thanks to you for tuning in. tonight's lead, no hiding from biden. for months mitt romney and paul ryan have been running from their records, hiding their extreme far right agenda behind...
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what tax approach do you think could be negotiated in the lame duck? >> you know, we've had deadlock for two years and it's been on the revenue side, not on the cutting side. we always seem to agree on various cuts to make, whether on the domestic discretionary programs like education or highways or on the entitlement programs, but we never seem to agree on revenues. i think one of the major stumbling blocks which i've pointed out people have bought on to the theory as part of deficit reduction we ought to lower the top rate on the highest income people. you lose a ton of revenue there and you can't make it up unless you squeeze the middle class. so if you're going to start out by saying the first thing we do is lower the rate from say 35 to 28 as simpson-bowles does or 25 as ryan does it's virtually impossible do deficit reduction without hurting the middle class. my suggestion intended to break this deadlock, this gridlock we've had on getting a budget deal for the last year and a half, let's get off this thing that the first thing we do is say we're
what tax approach do you think could be negotiated in the lame duck? >> you know, we've had deadlock for two years and it's been on the revenue side, not on the cutting side. we always seem to agree on various cuts to make, whether on the domestic discretionary programs like education or highways or on the entitlement programs, but we never seem to agree on revenues. i think one of the major stumbling blocks which i've pointed out people have bought on to the theory as part of deficit...
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taxes will have to be raised on the middle class if they succeed in their tax cut. folks, it's time to lift the burden off the middle class, not double-down on the great recession that hit them. >> that's the vice president at his first campaign event since last night's debate. there was another, let's just say intense debate going on last night but it waend biden/ryan. it was a bitter congressional race in california and it took a bizarre turn when both candidates nearly got into a fi physical fight right in front of the voters. let's take a look at this. >> that by the way with howard berman and brad sherman, two democrats in that new california system. they're running against each other in the general election for one seat in a merged district. >> crazy. >> another example of why americans are increasingly frustrated by the way our political system works or didn't work in some cases. our next guest says there's a silver lining, though, we just have to look back a century or so to find. he's the author of "the 100 greatest americans of the 0th century," a social j
taxes will have to be raised on the middle class if they succeed in their tax cut. folks, it's time to lift the burden off the middle class, not double-down on the great recession that hit them. >> that's the vice president at his first campaign event since last night's debate. there was another, let's just say intense debate going on last night but it waend biden/ryan. it was a bitter congressional race in california and it took a bizarre turn when both candidates nearly got into a fi...
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i disagree. >> mitt romney's tax proposals, because he has said that he can cut taxes without blowing up the deficit, without being deficit neutral, and at the same time keep defense spending. >> yeah. >> increase the defense budget. how does that work? >> governor romney said he can lower marginal tax rates and generate offsetting revenue so we don't increase the side of the deficit. >> how do you generate that? >> you reduce the number of write-offs and loopholes in some combinations. >> which would you reduce? he's not been specific. >> he's provided more specificity than the president and any candidate. >> he's not specific about which deductions. >> one of the things he's said is a mechanism that limits val i of all itemized deductions might be one way to go. that's a way that you take a whole basket of all of the itemized deductions. >> 17,000. >> maybe it's some other number. but andrea, this is very specific. he's called for a cross the board marginal rate reductions, specified amount, 20%, insisted no increase in taxes on the middle class, that's one of the parameters, he sai
i disagree. >> mitt romney's tax proposals, because he has said that he can cut taxes without blowing up the deficit, without being deficit neutral, and at the same time keep defense spending. >> yeah. >> increase the defense budget. how does that work? >> governor romney said he can lower marginal tax rates and generate offsetting revenue so we don't increase the side of the deficit. >> how do you generate that? >> you reduce the number of write-offs and...
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he talked about not taxing the wealthy. now he says he will tax the wealthy. he talks about energy independence now but didn't support the president on his programs to create alternative forms of energy for our country, which this president did. he talks about tax changes to help business development. who did that? president obama, with 100% tax credit in manufacturing, for example, which has just sizzled across the industrial midwest with the business start-ups that we see. even art furnaces being installed on the ohio republic steel. we haven't seen this in two decades. so, he can talk as a candidate, but the president has done it in a very difficult situation that he inherited from the bush administration, where the whole country's economy collapsed because of those titans up on wall street that tied up the finances of this country, and literally, we've had the largest transfer of wealth in american history from main street to wall street. you think that mitt romney, who was a part of that culture, is going to change anything for the people of this country?
he talked about not taxing the wealthy. now he says he will tax the wealthy. he talks about energy independence now but didn't support the president on his programs to create alternative forms of energy for our country, which this president did. he talks about tax changes to help business development. who did that? president obama, with 100% tax credit in manufacturing, for example, which has just sizzled across the industrial midwest with the business start-ups that we see. even art furnaces...
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that's why romney and ryan support preserving tax cuts for all the capital gains and carried interest. everything else, my friend, your mortgage interest tax deduction and everything else is on table. >> okay. if that was the high point of joe biden talking about the economy last night we have a long way to go. americans still don't believe the stimulus worked. we're dealing with the weak economy. that's reality to people. >> but we also know , jonathan, let me jump in here. congressman ryan, they heard that he asked for stimulus money. are democrats now fired up? we were in kentucky live. we talked to people all day, talked to people this morning. i found it intriguing that people have been criticizing joe biden. we clearly know what his mission was. i even said we should play the music from "mission: impossible" and show his face. his commission was clear, he opened the envelope, he read it, it get get 'em and he did. obviously conservatives would not like that tone, not like that congressman ryan was interrupted, i believe they said like 17 times. who's counting. the bottom line, d
that's why romney and ryan support preserving tax cuts for all the capital gains and carried interest. everything else, my friend, your mortgage interest tax deduction and everything else is on table. >> okay. if that was the high point of joe biden talking about the economy last night we have a long way to go. americans still don't believe the stimulus worked. we're dealing with the weak economy. that's reality to people. >> but we also know , jonathan, let me jump in here....
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lower taxes are responsible for that. and the obama administration has lowered taxes consistently. it's brought in less revenue. >> let's look at the question about the dow jones average. it's fascinating. this president has been seen as being hostile to wall street. wall street believes that wall street has been treated badly. you look at these numbers, and you have to ask that bill clinton question, are you going to believe me or your liein' eyes? >> the fact is that the dow did take a small dump right before obama became president. >> that's one way to put it. >> so he is a beneficiary of this massive rise. >> i now can see it. >> we've got to introduce to you bill karins, but go ahead. >> the dow was way, way down when obama took office. and it has basically doubled during his tenure. the fact is a lot of americans were not invested in it. a lot of americans pulled their money out of their mutual funds. they're either sitting on the sidelines or sitting in bonds. >> mark halhalperin, i'm sure wl hear a lot of this tonight. the question, are you better off now than you were four
lower taxes are responsible for that. and the obama administration has lowered taxes consistently. it's brought in less revenue. >> let's look at the question about the dow jones average. it's fascinating. this president has been seen as being hostile to wall street. wall street believes that wall street has been treated badly. you look at these numbers, and you have to ask that bill clinton question, are you going to believe me or your liein' eyes? >> the fact is that the dow did...
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we've seen you move to the middle on taxes saying, okay, i'm not going to cut taxes in a way that's going to raise the deficit. that's my rule. it's a hard, fast rule. he moved to the center on bipartisanship, on israel. i guess the question is, does that make him a more electable? i think it does. or does that make him the etch-a-sketch candidate? what's your read? >> well, i think that in addition to ann romney and his sons, i think there is an extended romney family within the campaign. people who have been with him throughout his career in politics. dating back to when he was governor of massachusetts. and i think they have been clambering for mitt romney to be more mitt romney than this right-wing creation we saw during the primaries, and i think they probably had a family conference at which point they thought, let's stop, you know, you pretending to be someone you're not. you've been doing it for two years, you get the nomination. let's be mitt romney. does it make him more electable? absolutely. >> andrea, i know you will remember this because you were covering it. but i go back t
we've seen you move to the middle on taxes saying, okay, i'm not going to cut taxes in a way that's going to raise the deficit. that's my rule. it's a hard, fast rule. he moved to the center on bipartisanship, on israel. i guess the question is, does that make him a more electable? i think it does. or does that make him the etch-a-sketch candidate? what's your read? >> well, i think that in addition to ann romney and his sons, i think there is an extended romney family within the...
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what $5 trillion tax cut? what was being presented wasn't leadership. that's salesmanship. >> when the storm clouds clear, which romney will voters remember? the bone dry severe conservative or the misty massachusetts moderate? the paradox of the mittens, a multi volume extravaganza continues. john heilemann, what do we make, what do you specifically make, of this politico inside dope that says ann and tagg romney have been instrumental in this recalibrated mitt romney? >> i never want to take exception that anybody mike allen and jim vandehei write but maybe there's a straining to find a more biz zanty explanation than is necessarily the case. to question that ann romney was unhawpe with what was happening to her husband as any reasonable wife would be, given the way he was being portrayed and allowing people to portray himself. there's, you know, losing campaign, which the romney campaign was until the debate in denver, there's always a lot of second guessing and it started early in this campaign. she clearly has made her feelings known in a very dire
what $5 trillion tax cut? what was being presented wasn't leadership. that's salesmanship. >> when the storm clouds clear, which romney will voters remember? the bone dry severe conservative or the misty massachusetts moderate? the paradox of the mittens, a multi volume extravaganza continues. john heilemann, what do we make, what do you specifically make, of this politico inside dope that says ann and tagg romney have been instrumental in this recalibrated mitt romney? >> i never...
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$5 trillion in tax cuts that he can't pay for? not if i've got anything to say about it. >>> plus, a tea party group accused of hovering and getting into faces is under fire. congressman cummings is demanding answers. he's here exclusively. >>> and live from new york, it's me, our friends at "snl" took on yours truly and the msnbc team. oh, yeah, i've got something to say about it. you're watching "politicsnation" on msnbc. >> it's a mile below the earth so for him, speaking to colorado was like being flown two miles into the air and having to give a speech in outer space. an intense burning sensation i woke up with this horrible rash on my right side. like somebody had set it on fire. and the doctor said, cindie, you have shingles. he said, you had chickenpox when you were a little girl... i said, yes, i did. i don't think anybody ever thinks they're going to get shingles. but it happened to me. for more of the inside story, visit shinglesinfo.com mom? who's mom? i'm the giants mascot. eat up! new jammin jerk chicken soup has tas
$5 trillion in tax cuts that he can't pay for? not if i've got anything to say about it. >>> plus, a tea party group accused of hovering and getting into faces is under fire. congressman cummings is demanding answers. he's here exclusively. >>> and live from new york, it's me, our friends at "snl" took on yours truly and the msnbc team. oh, yeah, i've got something to say about it. you're watching "politicsnation" on msnbc. >> it's a mile below the...
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i want to get my first income tax check. i want to get a driver's license. i want to get a car that's legit under my name. >> have you ever had any of these experiences? >> no. >> but later in our stay, sanchez found out that due to a miscalculation of his sentence, his release would be delayed by 15 days. >> when we checked in with joe a couple weeks later, he was preparing to go to a meeting with prison staff. he was going to be told that they had miscalculated his good time. he was going to have to stay in prison longer. >> are you going to come out or not? >> he knew all this going into the meeting, but he still had a very bad reaction. >> stay with your back to the door. >> oh, cut it out. >> you cut it out. >> it's protocol for an inmate when he's leaving his unit to be strip searched and they have to squat and cough so staff knows he's not hiding any weapons in a body cavity. joe had been doing that forever. he had done it a million times, and suddenly as he was nearing his release date he started to refuse to do it. >> no, i ain't got nothing on me.
i want to get my first income tax check. i want to get a driver's license. i want to get a car that's legit under my name. >> have you ever had any of these experiences? >> no. >> but later in our stay, sanchez found out that due to a miscalculation of his sentence, his release would be delayed by 15 days. >> when we checked in with joe a couple weeks later, he was preparing to go to a meeting with prison staff. he was going to be told that they had miscalculated his...
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plan. >> this was dishonest. >> i'm not in favor of a $5 trillion tax cut. >> the governor knows his $5 trillion tax cut isn't too popular, so a few weeks before the election, he's trying to pretend it doesn't exist. >> reporter: president obama at a star-studded fundraising concert in los angeles sunday heads to san francisco today with romney's poll numbers improving. >> they're looking very good. i feel very good. >> reporter: after the debate, romney is within two points of the president. and tomorrow, both candidates head to ohio, battleground ohio, where early voting is already under way. tomorrow is the last day to register to vote there. veronica? >> thank you. mitt romney will deliver that major policy speech before noon eastern, but the obama campaign is issuing a preemptive strike with this new tv ad criticizing the republican candidate's past foreign policy faux pas. take a look. >> reckless. amateurish. that's what news media and fellow republicans called mitt romney's gaffe-filled july tour of england, israel, and poland, when our u.s. diplomats were attacked in libya,
plan. >> this was dishonest. >> i'm not in favor of a $5 trillion tax cut. >> the governor knows his $5 trillion tax cut isn't too popular, so a few weeks before the election, he's trying to pretend it doesn't exist. >> reporter: president obama at a star-studded fundraising concert in los angeles sunday heads to san francisco today with romney's poll numbers improving. >> they're looking very good. i feel very good. >> reporter: after the debate, romney is...
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specifically the 20% across the board tax cut. why are they being so vague and will governor romney get specific at this debate? >> you know, it's funny. it cuts both ways. i think the reason they're not going specific is because they don't want to be attacked. they put the romney and ryan ticket on the defense. but i've heerd governor romney say this. he says i want to work in a bipartisan way. i want to work with democrats on capitol hill. i want to do what george w. bush did with no child left behind. that's to allow the congress -- that is to allow the legislative branch to be a part of the process. and thus in the process create or draft a piece of legislation that we can all work with. so i think it's a combination of both answers, alex. >> president obama had tough reviews following the first debate. what do you think is the greatest challenge in round two? >> the white house said to make adjustments. i think it's to make the adjustments without overcorrecting in some way. i don't think the voters want him to come out compl
specifically the 20% across the board tax cut. why are they being so vague and will governor romney get specific at this debate? >> you know, it's funny. it cuts both ways. i think the reason they're not going specific is because they don't want to be attacked. they put the romney and ryan ticket on the defense. but i've heerd governor romney say this. he says i want to work in a bipartisan way. i want to work with democrats on capitol hill. i want to do what george w. bush did with no...
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the tax code. what governor romney and what paul ryan have said is let's have a fair flatter simpler more competitive tax code, bring down rates and broaden the base. start to get rid of all the different loopholes and all the different exemptions. and so this is how you can have a tax code again that is fair, flatter, simpler and is revenue neutral, which of course we have now -- there's at least a half dozen economists, economic organizations, who have said this is true. you've had fact checkers with respect to the president's claim that this increases taxers say that's false. it doesn't. so here is the framework and what mitt romney said is i'm willing to work with both sides of the aisle republicans and sdms to get the details right and t president has never worked with republicans. there is no doubt that the president wants to increase taxes on small businesses, the job engine of america. >> i think there's no doubt we just heard a review what have we might hear from paul ryan tonight. congres
the tax code. what governor romney and what paul ryan have said is let's have a fair flatter simpler more competitive tax code, bring down rates and broaden the base. start to get rid of all the different loopholes and all the different exemptions. and so this is how you can have a tax code again that is fair, flatter, simpler and is revenue neutral, which of course we have now -- there's at least a half dozen economists, economic organizations, who have said this is true. you've had fact...
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i don't have a tax cut that's 4.8 trillion or $5 trillion. i'm not going to cut taxes on the rich. i don't have a medicare voucher program. i love teachers. we need more of them. don't believe me. speaker gingrich was pretty elegant in the primaries saying, look, mitt romney will say absolutely anything to get elected. >> and here's ""the new yorker's" take on the debate. it shows mitt romney debating an empty chair. >>> president obama continues be on his fundraising swing through california looking to capitalize on friday's good economic news. september unemployment rate released on friday dipped to 7.8%, the lowest of his presidency. and new fundraising numbers show the obama campaign is coming off its best month of the year raising $181 million in september. at a fundraising concert last night in los angeles the president added to his campaign coiffers. after thanking the stars for the performance, the president commented on his own performance. >> everybody here is incredible professionals, such great friends. they performed flawlessly, night after night. i can't always say th
i don't have a tax cut that's 4.8 trillion or $5 trillion. i'm not going to cut taxes on the rich. i don't have a medicare voucher program. i love teachers. we need more of them. don't believe me. speaker gingrich was pretty elegant in the primaries saying, look, mitt romney will say absolutely anything to get elected. >> and here's ""the new yorker's" take on the debate. it shows mitt romney debating an empty chair. >>> president obama continues be on his...
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they pay more effective tax than governor romney pays in his federal income tax. >> even when biden wasn't on his campaign talking points he was using his very own special brand of biden-ooez to tug the rug out from under paul ryan's feet. >> this is a bunch of stuff. look here's the deal -- >> what does that mean. >> we irish call it mularkey. >> the greatest hope for republicans was a gaffe but biden managed to take his weakness and redirect it towards governor romney. >> romney is a good man, he cares about 100% of americans in this country. with respect to that quote, i think the vice president very well knows that sometimes the words don't come out of your mouth the right way. >> i always say what i mean. and so does romney. >> this morning both sides are claiming victory and, indeed, everything may change in the next five days when president obama and governor romney take the stage again. but what biden did give is the president -- gave the president a path throwing his detractors off the scent and leading his best friend on the path towards victory. franklin, as the new guy at the t
they pay more effective tax than governor romney pays in his federal income tax. >> even when biden wasn't on his campaign talking points he was using his very own special brand of biden-ooez to tug the rug out from under paul ryan's feet. >> this is a bunch of stuff. look here's the deal -- >> what does that mean. >> we irish call it mularkey. >> the greatest hope for republicans was a gaffe but biden managed to take his weakness and redirect it towards governor...